INTERVIEW WITH GAGAN THAPA (http://www.kantipuronline.com)
"This movement is a struggle for power between the people and the palace. It will end only after achieving complete democracy or Loktantra." - Gagan Thapa, student leader A representative of Nepal's conscious young generation and a prominent student leader affiliated to Nepal Students Union, Gagan Thapa has consistently called for a total restructuring of the state and its politics. A strong supporter of republicanism in the country, he has not even spared his own mother party, the Nepali Congress, criticizing it for the lack of intra-party democracy. Thapa recently spoke to Akhilesh Tripathi on a number of issues. Excerpts:
ekantipur: What are you doing these days?
Gagan Thapa: These days I am busy organising, coordinating and participating in the protest demonstrations of the seven political parties against the autocratic royal regime. As the royal government has resorted to cruel repressive measures including baton-charging, torturing and arresting political leaders and activists to curb peaceful public protests, I am trying to avoid arrest so that I can coordinate the protest programmes from my level.
ekantipur: How do you see the student movement in the current political movement to restore democracy?
Thapa: In the beginning, this movement was for the restoration of democracy. But it is my conviction that this movement, due to the students' commitment and clear vision, has taken a qualitative leap forward: now it's a movement for the restoration of Loktantra in the country. It is the students' front, which created the objective ground for this movement to come to this point. And even at this point, the students are simultaneously shouldering two very crucial responsibilities. First, they are in the frontline of the parties' movement. Second, they are working as a pressure group so that the parties cannot deviate from their agenda.
ekantipur: Where is this movement heading? Are the parties clear about the students' as well as their own agendas?
Thapa: Talking about clarity in the movement's agenda, I must say, the parties are much clearer than before. If you talk about the participation in the movement, it is much wider now. However, we need more clarity on certain agendas. For example, though the parties have envisaged a democratic system without the institution of monarchy, there still are some misgivings that the current movement of the parties will end after reaching a compromise with the palace. And this is why the people have not been able to take it as the decisive movement.
ekantipur: Will this movement reach its goal or it will conclude at a compromise with the palace? What do you think?
Thapa: Even if the parties spearheading this movement reach a compromise with the palace, the movement will move forward in a new way, leaving the parties behind. I am not saying this in a fit of emotion. This is the truth and world history is testimony to this truth. The parties will become irrelevant if they do so. In the past, the CPN-UML and the NC-D reached a compromise with the palace and formed a coalition government. But other parties gave continuity to the movement and now even the UML and the NC-D have joined them. Therefore, I am confident that the movement will not end at any compromise with the palace. This movement is a struggle for power between the people and the palace. It will end only after achieving complete democracy or Loktantra. It will not end for petty issues like the postponement of the municipal elections, formation of an all-party government or the restoration of the dissolved parliament. The people should be able to feel the arrival of a complete change in the country when this movement ends. In one sentence, this movement should not be ended for anything less than the announcement for an election to a constituent assembly. This is the bottom-line of the movement.
ekantipur: The Maoists have been demanding constituent assembly elections from the very beginning. Now other parties, too, have made it their agenda. But it is said it was a result of pressure from the Maoists. What do you think?
Thapa: Our party, the Nepali Congress, had clearly expressed its commitment in its manifesto issued during the movement against the Rana oligarchy in 1950, for a legitimate body elected by the people to draft the country's new constitution after the end of the movement. Thus, the Nepali Congress is the first party to talk about constituent assembly elections in the country. In the last 50 years of the country's political history, different parties at different times have made constituent assembly election their demand. Therefore, it must be clear that constituent assembly election is not the agenda of only the Maoists. It is a purely democratic process, which, I think, should be welcomed by all democratic parties.
ekantipur: What is the situation of intra-party democracy in the Nepali Congress?
Thapa: Political parties are social organisations. They cannot keep themselves aloof from the different social changes. We want to establish Loktantra in the country and if the same is sought within the Nepali Congress or any other party then it should be taken positively. The intra-party democracy in the Nepali Congress is in crisis and our campaign is also to strengthen the intra-party democracy.
ekantipur: What do you think of the ad-hoc committee of Nepal Students Union that has been recently formed following the postponement of its Pokhara General Convention?
Thapa: Only the activists of the Nepal Students Union have the right to choose its leadership. It's their sovereign right and no one else's, not even the NSU's mother party has this right. After the postponement of NSU's General Convention in Pokhara, another convention should have been called to elect NSU's leadership. But the party, instead, formed an ad-hoc leadership by violating the party statute. By doing so, the party has snatched away the students' sovereign right to choose their leadership. For the time being we have slightly ignored this issue as we are dealing with a bigger issue- the national movement to establish Loktantra in the country. But we will not abandon our campaign of seeking intra-party democracy.
ekantipur: Many say that the Nepali Congress leadership wants to end your political career. Do you agree?
Thapa: Personally I feel that my accountability is more towards the generation I represent. The generation, feeling and the part of society that I represent are a priority for me. I am committed to them. At the same time I am confident that they put a lot of trust in me. This always keeps me full of energy and enthusiasm. I am an honest cadre of the party and I must observe the party discipline. But in the name of observing party discipline, I cannot obey the orders from the party leadership if they are against my commitment to the generation I represent. This is the problem between myself and the party. It is not possible for a person or two to end the career of a political worker. Because, in the past two-three years, it's not only the people's understanding of the monarchy that has changed; people's understanding of the parties' leaderships, too, has changed.
ekantipur: Some say that the NC leadership gradually started to sideline you after your relation with NC President Girija Prasad Koirala's daughter Sujata Koirala worsened. Is it true?
Thapa: I am least concerned about the fact that she is the daughter of NC President Koirala. People have the right not to acknowledge even the person who is born a son to the King. To be respected and acknowledged can be nobody's birthright. At least I cannot do this to anybody just on the basis of the so-called birthright. However, she is an elected central member and therefore a leader of the party. Respecting her on this basis is a different thing altogether. Another thing, for the past 4-5 years I have consistently moved forward with my ideology. Up to a certain point, she, too, agreed with this ideology of mine and it looked from outside as if we were in total agreement. I continued to move along sticking to my ideology but she deviated from it at a certain point. Maybe I am of lower rank in the party hierarchy and she is much above me but I have been consistent in my thinking and ideology.
ekantipur: Some say you are a royalist. Even NC President Koirala once said you and Narhari Acharya are royalists. Why do you think a politician as mature as Koirala said this?
Thapa: The NC president has personally refuted this, saying he never said anything like this. One part of the story ended then and there. However, I am not the first person to be accused with such charges in the party. There have been other instances where the party leadership has, instead of trying to manage those who disagree with it in a legitimate way within the party, has tried to damage their political career by accusing them in some way. Within the past 2-3 years, I have been accused of being a royalist, an American agent, a Maoist sympathiser, and lately an Indian Embassy agent of Prakash Koirala who was recently expelled from the party. I have never really taken these allegations seriously. However, I must prove myself. Just dismissing or refuting these allegations is not enough. I have to really prove everyday and every moment through my actions that I am not a royalist or anything as mentioned in the other allegations. Because, this is a bitter reality of Nepali politics. Who would think that Radha Krishna Mainali who spent decades in Nepal's communist revolution, would one day become a palace devotee? Therefore you cannot blindly trust anybody. One has to prove oneself everyday. And I think I have always proved myself.
ekantipur: You talk about republicanism whereas your own party has not made republicanism its agenda?
Thapa: I still remember the day when I had to furnish clarification to the party for publicly speaking in favour of constituent assembly elections. And when Maoist chairman Prachanda once mentioned my name in one of their programmes then again I had to clarify. I was sacked from my position in the NSU central committee when I raised the issue of republicanism. But now, the same party, through its last General Convention, has deleted all references to monarchy from its statute. And it has also agreed to the demand for constituent assembly elections. See! Our agenda is gradually gaining ground inside the party. Who could have imagined that the Nepali Congress would one day delete all references to monarchy from its statute and make constituent assembly elections one of its slogans? But it did. Therefore, I am confident that one day the party will make the demand for a republican set-up its agenda.
ekantipur: Will everything be alright if there is a republican set-up in the country?
Thapa: Republicanism is not a solution in itself. Monarchy is the root cause of the crisis plaguing the country. Therefore, for the country to come out of this crisis, a complete demolition of monarchy is a must. Only then is a solution possible. In this sense, republicanism is just the starting point. We can achieve Loktantra only through the path of Ganatantra (republicanism).
ekantipur: What are you doing these days?
Gagan Thapa: These days I am busy organising, coordinating and participating in the protest demonstrations of the seven political parties against the autocratic royal regime. As the royal government has resorted to cruel repressive measures including baton-charging, torturing and arresting political leaders and activists to curb peaceful public protests, I am trying to avoid arrest so that I can coordinate the protest programmes from my level.
ekantipur: How do you see the student movement in the current political movement to restore democracy?
Thapa: In the beginning, this movement was for the restoration of democracy. But it is my conviction that this movement, due to the students' commitment and clear vision, has taken a qualitative leap forward: now it's a movement for the restoration of Loktantra in the country. It is the students' front, which created the objective ground for this movement to come to this point. And even at this point, the students are simultaneously shouldering two very crucial responsibilities. First, they are in the frontline of the parties' movement. Second, they are working as a pressure group so that the parties cannot deviate from their agenda.
ekantipur: Where is this movement heading? Are the parties clear about the students' as well as their own agendas?
Thapa: Talking about clarity in the movement's agenda, I must say, the parties are much clearer than before. If you talk about the participation in the movement, it is much wider now. However, we need more clarity on certain agendas. For example, though the parties have envisaged a democratic system without the institution of monarchy, there still are some misgivings that the current movement of the parties will end after reaching a compromise with the palace. And this is why the people have not been able to take it as the decisive movement.
ekantipur: Will this movement reach its goal or it will conclude at a compromise with the palace? What do you think?
Thapa: Even if the parties spearheading this movement reach a compromise with the palace, the movement will move forward in a new way, leaving the parties behind. I am not saying this in a fit of emotion. This is the truth and world history is testimony to this truth. The parties will become irrelevant if they do so. In the past, the CPN-UML and the NC-D reached a compromise with the palace and formed a coalition government. But other parties gave continuity to the movement and now even the UML and the NC-D have joined them. Therefore, I am confident that the movement will not end at any compromise with the palace. This movement is a struggle for power between the people and the palace. It will end only after achieving complete democracy or Loktantra. It will not end for petty issues like the postponement of the municipal elections, formation of an all-party government or the restoration of the dissolved parliament. The people should be able to feel the arrival of a complete change in the country when this movement ends. In one sentence, this movement should not be ended for anything less than the announcement for an election to a constituent assembly. This is the bottom-line of the movement.
ekantipur: The Maoists have been demanding constituent assembly elections from the very beginning. Now other parties, too, have made it their agenda. But it is said it was a result of pressure from the Maoists. What do you think?
Thapa: Our party, the Nepali Congress, had clearly expressed its commitment in its manifesto issued during the movement against the Rana oligarchy in 1950, for a legitimate body elected by the people to draft the country's new constitution after the end of the movement. Thus, the Nepali Congress is the first party to talk about constituent assembly elections in the country. In the last 50 years of the country's political history, different parties at different times have made constituent assembly election their demand. Therefore, it must be clear that constituent assembly election is not the agenda of only the Maoists. It is a purely democratic process, which, I think, should be welcomed by all democratic parties.
ekantipur: What is the situation of intra-party democracy in the Nepali Congress?
Thapa: Political parties are social organisations. They cannot keep themselves aloof from the different social changes. We want to establish Loktantra in the country and if the same is sought within the Nepali Congress or any other party then it should be taken positively. The intra-party democracy in the Nepali Congress is in crisis and our campaign is also to strengthen the intra-party democracy.
ekantipur: What do you think of the ad-hoc committee of Nepal Students Union that has been recently formed following the postponement of its Pokhara General Convention?
Thapa: Only the activists of the Nepal Students Union have the right to choose its leadership. It's their sovereign right and no one else's, not even the NSU's mother party has this right. After the postponement of NSU's General Convention in Pokhara, another convention should have been called to elect NSU's leadership. But the party, instead, formed an ad-hoc leadership by violating the party statute. By doing so, the party has snatched away the students' sovereign right to choose their leadership. For the time being we have slightly ignored this issue as we are dealing with a bigger issue- the national movement to establish Loktantra in the country. But we will not abandon our campaign of seeking intra-party democracy.
ekantipur: Many say that the Nepali Congress leadership wants to end your political career. Do you agree?
Thapa: Personally I feel that my accountability is more towards the generation I represent. The generation, feeling and the part of society that I represent are a priority for me. I am committed to them. At the same time I am confident that they put a lot of trust in me. This always keeps me full of energy and enthusiasm. I am an honest cadre of the party and I must observe the party discipline. But in the name of observing party discipline, I cannot obey the orders from the party leadership if they are against my commitment to the generation I represent. This is the problem between myself and the party. It is not possible for a person or two to end the career of a political worker. Because, in the past two-three years, it's not only the people's understanding of the monarchy that has changed; people's understanding of the parties' leaderships, too, has changed.
ekantipur: Some say that the NC leadership gradually started to sideline you after your relation with NC President Girija Prasad Koirala's daughter Sujata Koirala worsened. Is it true?
Thapa: I am least concerned about the fact that she is the daughter of NC President Koirala. People have the right not to acknowledge even the person who is born a son to the King. To be respected and acknowledged can be nobody's birthright. At least I cannot do this to anybody just on the basis of the so-called birthright. However, she is an elected central member and therefore a leader of the party. Respecting her on this basis is a different thing altogether. Another thing, for the past 4-5 years I have consistently moved forward with my ideology. Up to a certain point, she, too, agreed with this ideology of mine and it looked from outside as if we were in total agreement. I continued to move along sticking to my ideology but she deviated from it at a certain point. Maybe I am of lower rank in the party hierarchy and she is much above me but I have been consistent in my thinking and ideology.
ekantipur: Some say you are a royalist. Even NC President Koirala once said you and Narhari Acharya are royalists. Why do you think a politician as mature as Koirala said this?
Thapa: The NC president has personally refuted this, saying he never said anything like this. One part of the story ended then and there. However, I am not the first person to be accused with such charges in the party. There have been other instances where the party leadership has, instead of trying to manage those who disagree with it in a legitimate way within the party, has tried to damage their political career by accusing them in some way. Within the past 2-3 years, I have been accused of being a royalist, an American agent, a Maoist sympathiser, and lately an Indian Embassy agent of Prakash Koirala who was recently expelled from the party. I have never really taken these allegations seriously. However, I must prove myself. Just dismissing or refuting these allegations is not enough. I have to really prove everyday and every moment through my actions that I am not a royalist or anything as mentioned in the other allegations. Because, this is a bitter reality of Nepali politics. Who would think that Radha Krishna Mainali who spent decades in Nepal's communist revolution, would one day become a palace devotee? Therefore you cannot blindly trust anybody. One has to prove oneself everyday. And I think I have always proved myself.
ekantipur: You talk about republicanism whereas your own party has not made republicanism its agenda?
Thapa: I still remember the day when I had to furnish clarification to the party for publicly speaking in favour of constituent assembly elections. And when Maoist chairman Prachanda once mentioned my name in one of their programmes then again I had to clarify. I was sacked from my position in the NSU central committee when I raised the issue of republicanism. But now, the same party, through its last General Convention, has deleted all references to monarchy from its statute. And it has also agreed to the demand for constituent assembly elections. See! Our agenda is gradually gaining ground inside the party. Who could have imagined that the Nepali Congress would one day delete all references to monarchy from its statute and make constituent assembly elections one of its slogans? But it did. Therefore, I am confident that one day the party will make the demand for a republican set-up its agenda.
ekantipur: Will everything be alright if there is a republican set-up in the country?
Thapa: Republicanism is not a solution in itself. Monarchy is the root cause of the crisis plaguing the country. Therefore, for the country to come out of this crisis, a complete demolition of monarchy is a must. Only then is a solution possible. In this sense, republicanism is just the starting point. We can achieve Loktantra only through the path of Ganatantra (republicanism).
Posted on: 2006-01-27 04:16:00
posted by dipeshb at 12:19 PM
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